January 23, 2008


2007 Pats at 1985 Bears (WhatIfSports.com)

Pats 21
Bears 7

Colin Cowherd mentioned this site on ESPN radio this morning--the 2007 Pats actually beat every team ever.

Posted by Orrin Judd at January 23, 2008 11:38 AM

I tried a different game, and got this:

2007 Pats 24
at1984 49ers 20

Yah, the Pats are that good.

Posted by: Brad S at January 23, 2008 1:22 PM


In other news the Pats won it all in Madden Football, or whatever video game the kids play.

The bottom line is the Pats are a very good team in a very mediocre league. There simply aren't many good teams in the NFL at the moment.

Going 14-2 or 15-1 in the NFC in the mid-80s, and then dominating in the playoffs is much more indicative of true greatness than going 19-0 today and playing so-so in the playoffs thus far.

Those Bears, Niners, Giants, and Skins teams who traded Superbowl victories in the 80s were much more impressive, and I suspect strongly, better teams, not least because whoever was going to win the Conference, and thus the Superbowl, had to beat the other three teams.

That the 85 Bears, 86 Giants, et al. dominated the playoffs is even more impressive. Hard to see either of those teams, or some of those Niner/Skin teams, struggling to beat the likes of Jacksonville and San Diego.

At the end of the day, Brady would wet his pants if he had to face those 80s NFC defenses.

Heck, by wearing that foot-brace in public the other day he's already busy setting up excuses for both the crap game he played Sunday, and for the mauling he'll take at the hands of the Giants D-line in 10 days.

Posted by: Jim in Chicago at January 23, 2008 1:38 PM

Geez, give it a rest. Weren't you the one who was saying that the Red Sox were dead back in September? How'd that work out?
Stick with futbol. At least nobody cares enough about that to contradict you.

Posted by: Bryan at January 23, 2008 2:33 PM


Those 80s defenses would be mauled by any modern team; the '07 Patriots have linebackers the size of the O-Line on those Bears. That would in any event be a bad matchup for them; don't forget that the Bears only meaningful loss was to Miami (a team defensive coordinator Ryan worried about beforehand) - depth and speed at receiver, a solid O-line, and an accurate, decisive quarterback. Sound like anybody?

Posted by: Mike Earl at January 23, 2008 2:37 PM

The Pats played the hardest schedule in NFL history this year, not only beating their Super Bowl opponent but their AFC Championship opponent and four other playoff teams. The Dolphins beat no one in '72.

Posted by: oj at January 23, 2008 4:31 PM

"Those 80s defenses would be mauled by any modern team; the '07 Patriots have linebackers the size of the O-Line on those Bears."

This guy never never saw Dan Hampton or Wilbur Marshall up close.

Posted by: andy krause at January 23, 2008 4:31 PM

2007 Pats were beaten 3 out of 3 times by the greatest defense ever, the 1991 Eagles.

Game played at Veteran's.

I agree with this.

Posted by: Benny at January 23, 2008 5:13 PM

da Bears:
Dan Hampton, DT: 6-5", 264.
Wilbur Marshall, LB: 6-1", 231.

'07 Pats:
Richard Seymour, DT: 6-6", 310.
Adelius Thomas, LB: 6-2", 270.

I'm not saying Hampton wasn't a talent, or wouldn't play today, but the old-school guys were almost human-sized, not like the goliaths out there today.

Posted by: Mike Earl at January 23, 2008 5:16 PM

Ah yes,
Orrin do you really love all the computer models? Probably the only more biased model would be the one for "we're all gonna die soon" global warming, and I'm pretty certain where you stand on that model.

Posted by: Mike at January 23, 2008 6:09 PM

Jeez, it'd be interesting to know if the programmer was from New England. As a Lions fan it pains me to say it, but the '85 Bears were the most dominant defensive team I've ever seen. In their two playoff games and the Super Bowl, they allowed a total of ten points. In the Super Bowl they made the Patriots look like a bunch of girls (final score 46-10). And I seem to recall some guy named Payton at running back. I'm guessing that's a game Bawston folks are still trying to forget. I actually got to sit behind the Bears' bench at three games that season.

Posted by: JimBobElrod at January 23, 2008 7:01 PM

Hmmm. Might be worth asking Bill Parcells what he thinks. I've heard that after his Giants got whipped by the '85 Bears a reporter asked him if he might win the game in a rematch, and he said something like "No way, you have no idea how hard they hit us."

Posted by: Matt Murphy at January 23, 2008 8:37 PM

1984 SF vs 2007 Cheatriots

Using a quick play dice game, the 49ers won all 3 games against the Cheats.

Using whatifsports's Sim Matchup, the 49ers won 40-28.

Posted by: G-Man at January 23, 2008 8:42 PM

Funny - I beat the 07 Pats with the Cowboys just last night on Madden '08 - with TO out on IR - sacked Brady 5 times (all-pro level for you gamers).

You know - I'm no Pats fan, and I'm rooting for NY, but anyone who tries to detract from their performance this season just comes across like Aesop's fox. Part of me wants the Pats to win so I can tell the grandkids how I saw the game live like my dad tells me about the 72 Fins.

Posted by: Shelton at January 23, 2008 9:08 PM

Styles make fights and as good as the Pats are, the best defensive teams ever have a better than average shot at beating them simply because the Pats defense is frankly sub-par for a "greatest team ever" contender.

Posted by: Benny at January 23, 2008 11:27 PM

The 1989 49ers were better than the 1984 version. Better offense, probably about a similar defense.

The 1976 Steelers were better than anyone of that era, and would have shut out the '85 Bears, who had only a moderate offense (which is partly why they did not win the big one again). The '78 Steelers scored 33, 34, and 35 points in successive playoff games (against good defenses).

Those NFC East teams from '82 through '95 were very good - they usually beat the speed teams up.

It's impossible to compare the lineman of today with even 20 years ago. Denver played for years with an OL probably averaging about 275 - but they can't get away with it today. Guys like Mike Webster, Jim Langer, Bob Kuechenberg, etc. all played at about 250-260.

But in this year's Super Bowl, we will see if the Giants DL can bring their speed rush against a beefier OL. It worked against Dallas - maybe it will work against the Pats.

Posted by: jim hamlen at January 23, 2008 11:59 PM


Hampton may have been a huge threat, but he was 6-5", 265#; if he was drafted today they'd convert him to linebacker. The Patriots have TEs bigger than that, and most of their D-line outweighs him by 50 pounds.

Both were great teams, and the cross-era comparisons are ridiculous.

Posted by: Mike Earl at January 24, 2008 11:14 AM

'07 Pats 18, '85 Bears 14 -- Gostowski kicks the winning field goal with 1:41 left in the game.

'07 Pats 27, '72 Dolphins 24 -- Maroney scores the winning TD with 3:39 left and the Pats D stuffs the Marine Mammals' 2-minute drill

'07 Pats 31, '88 49ers 28 -- Montana to Rice for a TD to bring the Squared Sevens to within 3 with 2:10 left to go, but SF fails to recover the onside kick

'07 Pats 14, '88 Bengals 21 -- Boomer Esiason goes 12-of-19 for 151 yards and 3 TDs, Ickey Woods and Laurence Maroney both rush for over 100 yards, but my law school classmate Cris Collinsworth has no catches.

Golly, this is fun!

Posted by: Mike Morley at January 24, 2008 12:30 PM