... nostalgia for Communism. I don't think so. They're nostalgic for the halcyon days of their youth when they really believed they were saving the world for Kumbaya.

They're smarter than you and me, and they know it. If only they could be given power over everyone else, they would institute sweeping changes that would bring about paradise on earth. Under a Communist system, people like them would have that necessary power. That's why the nostalgia.

It's a given they're smarter than us proles, but even so, that argument doesn't work because people like them did have the necessary power under Communism and things were, and are, very far from paradisiacal, therein lies the rub.

Ah, Mrs. Erp, the previous attempts failed because there were people(the U.S.) out there cheating. Once the cheaters are put in their place, the natural superiority of Communism will be so successful as to End History. Thus their spawning like need to destroy America, which remains past any hope of victory....

There is only one kind of good Communist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Nguyen.jpg

Never forget that Communism was evil to its core, evil in its motivs, ideals and aspirations, not merely in its operation.

When I go to the range tomorrow to practice for the Fathers' Day match, I shall take my S&W Bodyguard, the gun in the picture, to help me reflect upon this.

I suddenly realize that I am naturally applying a variant of Godwin's Law (i.e. "the first debater to bring up the Nazis in his argument immediately loses or is disqualified").

Namely, the instant I even hear the word "neocon" brought up, I immediately dismiss whovever is writing / talking as having absolutely nothing of any interest or value to say. The entire "neocon" concept is a crock. It never existed outside of a few political journals until the Bush admin, and since then has served as a catch-all polite expression of anti-semitism, anti-Americanism, and certainly anti-Bushism (BDS?).

Neo-con! Booga Booga Booga! Hide the kids!

"Neo-con" is short for "turn the page now, and go on to to something worth reading".

Mr. M. It's over. Thank God the younger generations are going in different directions.

I don't know Mrs. Erp. Bruno and Ptah and some of the others websites I've been reading seem ready to sell their souls to "secure the borders". And the primitive drive of our educated classes to serve on bended knee is still a wonder to behold.

There is only one kind of good Communist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Nguyen.jpg

Never forget that Communism was evil to its core, evil in its motives, ideals and aspirations, not merely in its operation.

When I go to the range tomorrow to practice for the Fathers' Day match, I shall take my S&W Bodyguard, the gun in the picture, to help me reflect upon this.

Happy shooting Lou. With you and your friends on our side, I don't worry about the borders ... and Happy Fathers Day to all you dads!

Andrew X:

Ditto! It's definitely a top entry in the Weasel-Word Olympics.

Here is a convenient list of all the different groups of people I've heard this term applied to:

1.) Conservative social scientists
2.) Jewish conservatives
3.) Jewish ex-leftists
4.) Individuals who have been conservatives their entire lives
5.) Democratic members of the Senate
6.) Military hawks who are Jewish and support Israel
7.) What few social conservatives exist in the universities
8.) Myself (by a liberal aunt who helped run the computer system at the Brookings Institution)
9.) Conservatives who hesitatingly believe in the free market but think it worsens certain social problems
10.) Free-market enthusiasts

I recently read Thomas Sowell's book on Marxism. I think I got a hint of just why this doctrine has fooled so many people. It's a condolence to the poor, it flatters the egos of disaffected intellectuals who dream of a better world and think they are smart enough to run it, and it lets the rich flatter themselves that they have bucked their class interest. It also has a holy book and a messiah, it seems to reject religion and "superstition" while stating that you can still get to heaven, it has an apocalyptic side that excites bored coffee-house radicals and adolescents, it claims to have all the answers and to be inevitable, and it runs on a "logical" foundation that is totally circular so no one can ever disprove it. Whew.

Neocons is rather easily defined: they're Jewish (ethnically, not religiously) intellectuals who moved Right because of Democratic indifference (or even hostility) to Israel and the Jews of Eastern Europe and because of affirmative action (and other discrete racial issues).

oj, even if your definition is correct, how many of them are there? A couple of dozen, a hundred? Probably not even.

They're few, but influential. The leading lights of the movement were Irving Kristol and Norman Podhoretz and their kids are still around. David Frum and Charles Krauthammer are allies of that second generation.

Two generations and Jewish voting habits haven't changed more than a tot.

American Jews aren't religious. They're good citizens though. Of course, using y'alls anti-Mexican logic, the nativists were right to oppose letting the Jews because they vote Democrat.

OJ:

Words and labels matter because they faciliate interpersonal communication. You have your own definition of this word. Other people have theirs. Still others, theirs. Me, I've counted ten.

There's no agreed meaning. It's just a Orwellian scarecrow term to frighten rich leftists into donating more cash to the Nation Institute. It also plays on subconscious antisemitic fears of a giant cabal that runs everything, smoothly transferring the odium to conservatives. Is there any good reason for us to keep playing this game by their rules?

No, it's described by its founder:

http://www.amazon.com/Neo-conservatism-Autobiography-Idea-Irving-Kristol/dp/1566632285/

... using y'alls anti-Mexican logic,... I hope this isn't referring to me. I am neither anti-immigration, legal or illegal, Mexican or any other, nor anti-Semitic, nor anti anything or anybody except, of course, anti lunatic leftwing politics.

My take on the Immigration Bill is that it's just a gambit to keep the kids amused and entertained during summer vacation, so while they "debate" and posture, the adults can continue to keep the world from blowing itself up.

It means nothing and nothing will come out of it.

I have to disagree with the premise that it's rare for people to admit that their ideas were mistaken. Free markets tend to force that realization rather easily. The market place of ideas fails because the state attaches itself to one mistaken ideology or another and accumulates power in the process. Only in politics and philosophy will bad products continue to find markets with the endless supply of elitist idiots.

You must not have ever worked for a corporation. The existence of bureaucrats refutes your claim.

OJ:

When Mr. Kristol invented the term I agree with you that he meant it to apply to Jewish ex-leftists who moved right partially in response to Jewish concerns. It also applied to certain social scientists. It clearly has no unified meaning today and since we can't put the toothpaste back in the tube we ought to drop the term entirely. Don't give the other side weapons.

It's still exactly the same.

OJ:

When the New York Times says Buckley is one it's obviously time to ditch the concept.

His magazine is neocon now. Their confusion is understandable.