May 10, 2004
ONLY CHUCK COLSON CARES:
Mistreatment of Prisoners Is Called Routine in U.S. (FOX BUTTERFIELD, 5/08/04, NY Times)
Physical and sexual abuse of prisoners, similar to what has been uncovered in Iraq, takes place in American prisons with little public knowledge or concern, according to corrections officials, inmates and human rights advocates.In Pennsylvania and some other states, inmates are routinely stripped in front of other inmates before being moved to a new prison or a new unit within their prison. In Arizona, male inmates at the Maricopa County jail in Phoenix are made to wear women's pink underwear as a form of humiliation.
At Virginia's Wallens Ridge maximum security prison, new inmates have reported being forced to wear black hoods, in theory to keep them from spitting on guards, and said they were often beaten and cursed at by guards and made to crawl.
The corrections experts say that some of the worst abuses have occurred in Texas, whose prisons were under a federal consent decree during much of the time President Bush was governor because of crowding and violence by guards against inmates. Judge William Wayne Justice of Federal District Court imposed the decree after finding that guards were allowing inmate gang leaders to buy and sell other inmates as slaves for sex.
The experts also point out that the man who directed the reopening of the Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq last year and trained the guards there resigned under pressure as director of the Utah Department of Corrections in 1997 after an inmate died while shackled to a restraining chair for 16 hours. The inmate, who suffered from schizophrenia, was kept naked the whole time.
Newsflash: Guards, who are in positions of power, abuse prisoners, who are powerless. If any one of us were a guard we'd do it too. Think a lot of these pundits and politicians are going to start speaking out for criminal inmates in the U.S.? Posted by Orrin Judd at May 10, 2004 4:41 PM
If that were true then all parents would abuse their children, all doctors their patients, all priests their congregants etc.
I don't think that's the case.
Posted by: Harry Eagar at May 10, 2004 5:35 PMThey don't make them wear the pink underwear in the Maricopa County jail to humiliate them. They do it so they'll stop stealing the underwear. And they're not women's underwear either. They're just boxer shorts dyed pink.
Posted by: Brandon at May 10, 2004 6:00 PMThere's a huge difference between a loving guardian over their wards, and a guard who watches someone who is "the enemy." And even then there are parents, priests, doctors, and more who do abuse people in their care.
I don't think there is a real debate on this, just how OJ articulates how much abuse is expected versus you or me or how someone else would state the problem.
Posted by: Chris Durnell at May 10, 2004 6:03 PMBrandon is right. I should know because I do live in Maricopa County. Sheriff Joe Arpaio makes them eat green bologna too.
Posted by: Chris Durnell at May 10, 2004 6:04 PMOne last comment - I think the prison system in the US is extremely flawed and obsolete. The idea of prison as a solution to crime is actually quite new. There really weren't any prisons before 1800. Jails, yes, but jails incarcerate people before trial, and were not a sentence.
The entire prison system is entirely too expensive. They are crime factories were criminals learn new skills from older inmates. We can't even keep drugs out of them, and they ARE a police state.
I think we need to phase out prison for non-violent offenders and use alternative punishments. There needs to be a serious debate on this in the country, but we are no where near discussing adequate solutions.
Posted by: Chris Durnell at May 10, 2004 6:09 PMChris:
The point being that such ideas are political non-starters.
Posted by: oj at May 10, 2004 6:34 PM"Harry:
Yes, but you believe you are without sin."
Lest anyone be confused, Harry has never said anything like that.
Dowd & OJ are twins.
Posted by: Jeff Guinn at May 10, 2004 7:00 PMJust a comment regarding prisoners themselves. I've had guard duty in the military for both US and foreign inmates. They can size a guard up pretty quick and make life tough. That can take the form of a cup of piss in your face, or a good goober hocked right on your shirt front. Your attitude goes sour pretty quick. Not too many angels behind bars and that should be emphasized more than it is.
Posted by: Tom Wall at May 10, 2004 8:35 PMI think OJ is being ironic, in that in Harry's view sin does not exist 'objectively' (for lack of a better term).
Posted by: Gideon at May 10, 2004 8:40 PMI'd like to think my point is a little more subtle than that.
What you do is what you really believe is the right thing to do. If it weren't, you'd do something else.
What you say you believe the right thing to do is pretty much irrelevant, much of the time.
Orrin's view is that humans are ravening beasts and nothing but fear of god prevents any of us from acting out.
Well, that's when what you do when you're not being watched counts, isn't it?
We all have our secrets. The behavior I've seen alleged (except perhaps any deaths if they pan out) at the military prisons is pretty tame; not a lot more savage than what I used to see in locker rooms when I was a sports reporter.
But even that behavior is probably outside the frame of reference of most of us. Most of the time.
Posted by: Harry Eagar at May 11, 2004 5:24 PMHarry:
To the contrary--I don't think fear of God stops us either. We just are Fallen.
Posted by: oj at May 11, 2004 5:51 PMWhat you do is what you really believe is the right thing to do. If it weren't, you'd do something else.
Harry: I've never seen the argument for the necessity of religion put so succinctly.
Posted by: David Cohen at May 12, 2004 9:49 AMDavid:
Despite Jeff's repeated protestations, that's precisely the sense in which he and Harry believe themselves incapable of sin--if they do it then it must be good.
Posted by: oj at May 12, 2004 10:00 AMBingo! And vice versa.
Posted by: Harry Eagar at May 12, 2004 2:35 PM