"Overreacting to the actual but rather minor abuses." So when Suddam's thugs rape, torture, and sexually abuse prisoners and detainees it is a moral outrage from which a nation should be liberated but when American sadits are photographed smiling after similiar "minor abuses" we should not overreact. The President is correct to being sickened, after all it was President Bush who declared that "Iraq is free of rape rooms and torture chambers." Oct 2003.

Arabs lie?

Uh, Keith, I think the point of the articles OJ posted was that these minor abuses are nothing like the "torture and rape rooms." Not even remotely close. Not even in the same chapter of the Sadist's Handbook. Pretty much everything that has come out that has been that bad has been decisively proved false.

This whole matter has become so surreal. I note in the media and also on some pro-war left/liberal sites that whenever anyone tries to put a context around the story, he is swarmed by a visceral "aren't we disgusting, we must atone, string up these guys..." argument. It reminds me of trying to argue with feminists in the 80's that there is abuse and then there is abuse. Merely to make the argument was conclusive proof of misogyny and a desire to oppress women. Don't you feel the Iraqi pain?

The funny thing is that many who are reacting this way also seem perfectly prepared to consider the notion that we may have to take out the entire faith of Islam in the name of human rights. Well, maybe not so funny.

The abuse does make me sick, but the overreaction to and exploitation of the phots makes me even more sick.

I suspect I'm with the majority of Americans as that seems to often be the case. Every time I think I hold a unique position, everyone else seems to be feeling the same way.

Once the tide starts rolling the left cannot control it so they over do it. Again and again and again. They are going to get troops killed because of it. Now THAT'S an atrocity.

So the press coverage of these horrible pictures is overreacting, but sending 150,000 troops to Iraq because Saddam annoys you isn't?

Euro:

Don't tell me you have never heard of the Doctrine of Hyper-Power Annoyance! It's a sub-set of Aquinas' just war theory.

They should have known the latest images were fakes when they clicked on the photos and got 30 X-rated pop-up windows on their browsers...

Euro:

Yes it was--we could have taken him out by supporting the Shi'a rebellion in '91.

The overreaction to this abuse is the flip side (Kerry-side?) of moral relativism-- very few things are bad, but when something is bad, there's no nuance. There can't be shades of gray, but must but perfect, black-body black. This has been determined, ex cathedra, to be bad, and therefore anyone who doesn't agree is equally bad.

And I find it fascinating that, considering what Saddam did was far worse than what a small group of people did for a few weeks shown in these photos, that the Leftist talking points are that Saddam was simply an annoyance. Is that only because we don't have public photos of the people being put in the mass graves and industrial shredders that that is the case? (And considering they way the thug mentality works, I'd be surprised if they didn't take pictures of their handiwork. )

Euro --

Your analogy, in particular the press' role in furthering American self-doubt and emboldening anti-American animus, is as intellectually dishonest as one can get outside of a MoveOn message board.

No, the real scandal is tye press not covering Saddam's genuine atrocities because he had them hostage; the press not covering the very real prospect that enough of his WMD arsenal (which I am sure you believe it never existed) is already in terrorist hands (which I am sure you never believed) and that this terrorists were masterminded out of Iraq (impossible), and that they had aimed to kill as tens of thousands in Jordan; the press not covering the chicanery behind the Franco-German-Russo axis to prop up Saddam in order to benefit from the Bribe for Oil scandal even as they lobbied every third world country to oppose enforcement of UN resolutions; the press not covering 1/1000th of the efforts -- military, civic, engineering, humanitarian -- that our men and women are proudly and gladly doing; that the press loves to expose and overexpose anything -- especially if vitriolic -- that would make any American question our right to self-defense but will beg off exposing anything that would "further" embolden Americans to take a stand against our enemies.

My rule on this would be: If you didn't react at least as strongly to abuse of Americans that was at least as bad, I ain't listening to you.

The leftists are trying to redefine the word "torture" to fit their agenda, similar to how they twisted the word "genocide" to throw it against Israel.

If you want examples of real torture there are graphic videos of Baathist pouring acid on prisoners' heads, removing tongues, and throwing grenades at them.

Not that you will see any of those videos on CNN anytime soon.

There's more out on the fake rape photos. BBC and AP also reported on rape photos -but could not verify they were real. AP reported on them anyway. Regardless of your political leanings, journalists need to excercise caution and not throw verification processes to the wind in all this....I'm surprised to see all the reporters reporting on whatever they're told by Iraqis even though they cannot verify anything being said. There is a place for that, in moderation (!), and depending on the reputation of the person speaking etc. But to just have a free-for-all is crazy. Most of these journalists are lazy too -in might be inordinately difficult to verify, so they just don't bother. Thanks a lot for nothing, reporters.

Fake rape photos
infuriate Arab world

Bogus GI rape photos used
as Arab propaganda

Porn site depicting 'GI rapes' shut down

These articles were mentioned yesterday at the White House Press Briefing (from CNN's transcript:)

QUESTION: What was the president's reaction to WorldNetDaily's report that photographs circulating all over the Middle East that depict American soldiers raping Iraqi women are false and originated on porn sites? So our embassy in Cairo issued this statement: "We have done a thorough investigation of the origin of these photos and have conclusive evidence that they originated on a pornographic Web site. They are clearly staged photos done by actors, as the site itself states."

MCCLELLAN: I don't know what's being sent around the Internet in terms of pictures that may be real or may not be real.

The president's made it very clear that there are people who are opposed to freedom that will seek to take advantage of this situation. What we've got to do is show the world that we take this matter very seriously, that we act on it and that we bring people to justice and we work to make sure that nothing like this happens again.

I haven't paid a great deal of attention to the photos, but of the few I've seen (which I'll take to be the most sensational available so far), none exceed what a friend of mine went through to join the Shrine.

However, in an ABC Radio report this morning, it was told that members of Congress say there are photos and videos yet to come of rape and murder.

Rape I could believe. Murder would surprise me. Not necessarily that it was done but that it would be photographed.

We'll see.