June 14, 2008
IT'S NOT A QUESTION OVER WHICH THEY HAVE JURISDICTION ANYWAY:
A Supreme Error (Fred Thompson, June 13, 2008, Townhall)
[A]s Justice Scalia pointed out in his dissent – they for the first time in our nation’s history, conferred a Constitutional right of habeas corpus on alien enemies detained abroad by our military forces in the course of an ongoing war – a broader right than has been given to our own citizens. The court majority did so acknowledging that they could find no precedent to confer such a right to alien enemies not within sovereign U.S. territoryPosted by Orrin Judd at June 14, 2008 11:53 AMThe majority had simply decided that prior courts had denied such rulings based on “practical considerations.” In other words in prior cases and prior wars it had just been too inconvenient to bestow the right of habeas corpus upon non-citizens in foreign jurisdictions. So, by focusing on what they saw as “practical” instead of those pesky court precedents based upon the issues of citizenship and foreign territory … and the Constitution … the majority reached the conclusion they wanted to, since what is practical is subjective. One can only ponder the state of our nation directed by the subjective instead of the Constitution.
As Chief Justice Roberts pointed out in his dissent, the court strikes down as inadequate the most generous set of protections ever afforded aliens detained by this country as enemy combatants.
I'm afraid I'm neither an expert on law or on history: if the decision is not in the Supreme Court's jurisdiction, can the President or Congress simply call them on it and continue what they're doing? I know it's quite possible for a Supreme Court to be wrong, but I'm uncertain what the correct next step would be, or maybe what the next politically-viable next step would be.
Posted by: Just John at June 14, 2008 5:17 PMRecall that if the President ignores them they can do nothing. It's only acquiesence that gives the Court power.
Posted by: oj at June 14, 2008 7:48 PMAndrew Jackson ignored the Supreme Court's order and had the Cherokee removed anyway. "John Marshall made his decision, let him enforce it." is the quote, IIRC.
If GWB did the same thing, it would make for an interesting backdrop to the campaign, for I am certain impeachment proceedings would begin. And the Chief Justice was one of those who dissented from the Supreme Court's decision.
I find it interesting that five members of the court decided to intervene in a political question, which the court's decision in Marbury v. Madison was a sidestep to keep them from making decision on a political question. I think it was pure folly on the part of the court to interject themselves like this into the war powers, which are reserved to the other two branches of government. Congress, upon reflection for what this means to its own jealously held enumerated powers, ought to be upset.
Much interesting fodder for speculation.
Posted by: Mikey at June 14, 2008 9:48 PMLet me see if I have this straight. President Obama can apprehend and take to Gitmo Álvaro Uribe Vélez and Vaclav Kaus and keep them imprisoned forever, and ignore any Supreme Court decision to the contrary.
Regarding separation of power
Posted by: h-man at June 15, 2008 6:45 AMOops.. Regarding separation of Power, whatever happened to the evidence obtained illegally by the executive branch in the Congressman Jefferson Case. Down the memory hole?
Posted by: h-man at June 15, 2008 6:59 AMYes, the Executive prosecutes wars, not the Judiciary. The Constitution confers no rights to the enemy.
Posted by: oj at June 15, 2008 8:28 AMThe Executive has police powers, that's why there's a Justice Department.
Posted by: oj at June 15, 2008 8:38 AMCongress can trump the Supreme Court by passing a law overturning this decision and the president may sign it or not as he sees fit.
Posted by: erp at June 15, 2008 9:18 AMCongress can't trump the Constitution anymore than the Court can.
Posted by: oj at June 15, 2008 10:36 AMTrue, but the Constitution doesn't speak to the rights of foreign hostiles.
Posted by: erp at June 15, 2008 1:58 PMI am afraid we are missing what has happened.
For one thing, The Constitution very much does apply to all sorts of persons, including enemy P.O.W.'s.
Surely we are not supposed to swallow the absurdity, the unjust absurdity, of locking people up and just forgetting about them because we can't handle the truth about the fight we are in.
The irony of this case is the notion that the jailhouse fighters might be lawful combatants--privileged belligerants is a better term. The cases at least imply this. If this is so, then they are properly confined until the conclusion of hostilities. Catch and release is never the rule for prisoners of war.
On the other hand, if they are not privileged belligerants, then they are war criminals and may dealt with according to the usages of the Law of War.
Our entire system in flip-flopping about this worse than Hanoi John Kerry, because we can't face the ramifications of the Global war against the jailhouse.
Posted by: Lou Gots at June 15, 2008 7:33 PMWhy wouldn't we be? What were the rights of the Confederate and Nazi POWs?
Posted by: oj at June 16, 2008 7:52 AM