An outrageously elitist statement by Krikorian. That passes for intelligence?

If you think about it, the fact that Honda has spent untold millions and has just about got a robot that can go down stairs and "run" at 6 kpm makes illegal immigration a world-historical bargain.

Krikorian? Came on the Mayflower, did he?

Not just anti-immigrant, but astoundingly anti-child as well. One can almost see him haranguing the kids playing ball on the street while his robot cuts the lawn.

Yes, b/c WE should be emulating the Japanese. Good grief.

Increasingly I prefer illegal immigrants from Mexico to NROniks. Can we start shipping the latter back to wherever they came from?

BTW, the Mexicans are mostly Roman Catholics and they like guns. Sounds like a win-win to me.

"illegal immigration a world-historical bargain."

Slavery was thought of in the same way until the mid-19th century.

But worse is the mindset being demonstrated here. That those people (illegal immigrants) are some sort of commodity to be exploited for our benefit. That strikes me as no different than the Leftist point of view, where a love of the masses is best demonstrated by subjugating them.

"Increasingly I prefer illegal immigrants from Mexico to NROniks"

Note also that there are three subsequent postings (on a Saturday night, no less) taking that statement to task. The kneejerk reactions of the anti-anti-immigrationists is just as ugly as the attitude they claim to abhor.

Were a group of Mexican robots to suddenly cross the border, I think some of the NRO posters would lock themsevles in their air raid shelter with a cache of weapons and a 15-year supply of canned goods.

After reading Kirkorian's comments, I may have been too quick to defend NR in earlier posts.

What is "anti-human anti-immigrationism"? Is there some other type of immigration involving non-humans? Perhaps "anti-Martian anti-immigrationism"?

Krikorian's point, which seemed quite clear, was that modern industrialized societies generally try to use automation to perform drudge-type labor, rather than to employ a class of menial laborers. I'm failing to see why you find that innocuous proposition to be so upsetting.

It's what they call static analysis. That wild and crazy Armenian isn't thinking beyond the first generation. In my neck of the woods (Oregon's Willamette Valley) the second generation is very much American.

On reflection, Kirkorian's statement is too stupid to be taken seriously, but the response is fascinating.

Raoul: Slavery and immigration are not the same. They are polar opposites. The immigrants want to come here. The find the bargain to be satisfactory because their income and quality of life are so much better here than the alternative. The question is why is there a small vocal minority so intent on blocking them? For their own good? It is to laugh.

I don't see three subsequent postings taking him to task. I see Podhoretz taking him to task, Stattaford -- another racist English immigrant trying to keep out anyone behind him -- sticking up for Krikorian and Podhoretz responding.

The clear message Krikorian is sending is better robots than people. I'm sorry, not people -- "illiterates from south of the border."

flenser: Anti-human anti-immigrationists are those who prefer robots to people. In other words, they oppose immigration because they hate the people who are immigrating. They're illiterates, don't you know. (By the way, Mexico has a respectable 92% literacy rate, according to the CIA. Why is it, do you think, that Krikorian just assumes that all Mexican immigrants are illiterate?

Krikorian's point is not at all innocuous. It was that Japan will be a more successful country in the future because it makes robots and we import illiterates from south of the border. Leaving to one side the technical, political, cultural and historic ignorance of the remark, he is clearly saying better robots than people.

Don't tar all the NR guys with the brush used on Krikorian. John Podhoretz is having a grand time cutting Krikorian down to size:

Gee, which country's [Japan's or the United States'] economy grew from $3 trillion to $5 trillion between 1990 and now and which country's economy more than doubled, from $5 trillion to $12 trillion? The country that did vastly better is the county that "imported illiterates."

What Mark Krikorian was saying is that America is being dragged down into the swamps of unproductive and un-innovative second-ratery by all these "illiterates" as compared to Japan. The idea that Japan is more innovative than America was all the rage back in, oh, 1985. Raising it again, as Mark did, is like wearing a Flock of Seagulls haircut. Don't get your hair cut that way, . . .

Raoul:

Learning to treat blacks as persons made whites a better people. Learning to welcome Jews, Catholics, etc. has done the same. It is a bargain.

Why so doctrinaire? We need and can handle both immigration to keep us going and robots to do the really dangerous or repetitive work like mine coal, defuse bombs, clear mine fields, put out forest fires, etc. Jack Bauer can't do it all by himself.

erp: I pro-robot, so long as we understand that they are tools to make life better for people.

Pronouns waste time.

So does spelling and punctuation, yet old habits die hard.

Everything we invent is to make our, i.e., human beings, lives better and easier. Computers and electronic gadgets like robots are tools. The Hondo robot is cute though. He definitely cops an attitude and I swear, his walk has been fashioned after our cocky president.

Remember about 25 years AI was going to far out think us. We'd learn once and for all, where humans fit into the big picture. A friend was working with the MIT group. Where is that program now? Haven't heard a thing about AI in decades.

The Honda robot is neat and a good way of proving some fairly sophisticated tech, but person-shaped robots are more a marketing gimmick than a prospective product. Instead, individual products will become more computerized and automated.

Forwarding this link to a list I subscribe to, elicited this thoughtful comment:

Heh, why buy a tractor when you can have slaves till the land for you?

I find it ironic that people are calling the robot supporter anti-human, while favoring using large numbers of humans for menial labor.

Y'know, I think this guy actually has a point.

BTW, something else to think about:

"The Reign of Augustus: a Sign for Our Times"
http://theocoid.blogspot.com/2006/05/reign-of-augustus-sign-for-our-times.html

Oops! Messed up a bit--the third line above is a *continuation* of the quote that begins in the *second* line--made a mistake with the italics.

Ah yes, the Underground Railroad sneaking blacks eager to be slaves over the Canadian border and into the deep South. The analogy is seamless.

Here's my answer, in the form of a riddle: What do you call the children of illegal aliens?

David:

Americans. And if you doubt that spend 50% of your time in El Paso like I have been over the past 6 months.

Bingo!

Jeff, we're all on the same page here.

erp:

AI, like fusion power and personal aircars, is 20 years away, and has been so for the last 40 years.