Also, notice the nice jump from evolution/astronomy/geology to abortificants.

Color me stupid, but what business is it for a state legislature to vote on morning after pills or any other pharmaceuticals?

It's bad enough the medical community isn't all that reliable, but some low brow from East Podunk deciding on these matters isn't to be tolerated.

On the other hand, 51% believe man evolved over millions of years from less advanced forms of life; hardly a stretch, then, that 35% consider Darwin's theory as well supported by the evidence, and since God's role in the matter is kept utterly vague, those who accept evolution but think God had a role in it can include just about anybody from those who think God micro-managed every last living being (which precludes free will) to God having created life and then basically disappeared.

And in the latest poll, we have 26% accepting evolution via natural selection without the guidance of a supreme being.

And then you have some portion of that tiny minority arguing that only their faith should be taught in pulic schools. No wonder they're getting shellacked on the issue. When the 13% who are Darwinist try to control the schools the reaction can't help but be good for the GOP.

If you're referring to the theory of evolution being taught in science class, well it happens to be the best and only scientific theory we have, supported by evidence and ongoing observations.

"When the 13% who are Darwinist try to control the schools..."

I see you've fallen back almost entirely on appealing to a couple of polls at this point. Okay, then for the sake of accuracy make that 13 to 26%.

And 51% accept evolution and a bunch of those are trying to fit God into it somehow. Details are vague at this point...

I wish the IDers well in coming up with a theory. They'd better do it quick.

"the reaction can't help but be good for the GOP."

I don't know - there's about 45% who think the GOP is too influenced by religious conservatives. This could just as easily backfire.

No, evolution should be taught. I'm an evolutionist like the 48%.--but the three main theories about what drives it should be presented, or else none.

Yes, the GOP grew used to being the 45% party for about 60 years.

"but the three main theories about what drives it should be presented, or else none"

Fine, but that doesn't mean they need to be presented in science class. For that they would need to be scientific theories.

If the IDers can be bothered to posit such a theory, I have no problem with that being taught in science class, alongside the theory of evolution.

Creationism, which plainly contradicts scientific evidence, can be taught in other, more suitable classes - Sunday school/church perhaps.

creeper:

Obviously none of them belong in science class--they belong in philosophy (Darwinism, Intelligent Design) and Religion (Creationism).

Since the theory of evolution is an accepted scientific theory, it obviously belongs in science class. You're welcome to study the philosophy of science in philosophy class.

ID so far rests on a couple of arguments like irreducible complexity that can be handled in philosophy class in 20 minutes or so.

ID has greater acceptance.

"ID has greater acceptance."

That doesn't change the fact that it rests on some flimsy arguments and has not even been presented as a scientific theory.

Not only that, but if you insist on running to the polls (as you do more and more these days), it's the other way around: 18% say they believe man evolved under the guidance of a supreme being, while 26% believe man evolved via natural selection.

Yes, but your argument in favoir of Darwinism is only that it is "accepted." It isn't.

I wasn't talking about polls, I was talking about it being accepted as a scientific theory. Which it is, and it is confirmed all the time.

The public accepts Creationism as its scientific theory at a far higher rate.

"The public accepts Creationism as its scientific theory at a far higher rate."

I'm not aware of any poll that asked whether Creationism was accepted as a scientific theory. You wouldn't have a link handy, would you? Certainly the Gallup poll and the Pew poll did not ask that question.

The Pew poll shows they accept it.

Not as a scientific theory. Stop obfuscating.

I was pretty clear, Orrin: I'm not aware of any poll that asked whether Creationism was accepted as a scientific theory. The Pew poll did not ask that question.

AFAIK, there is no such poll.

creeper:

Just because you don't think it's science doesn't mean the rest of us don't. Pew asked how we got here and they answered. That is their science.

Pew also asked what should be taught in schools and they answered--they think it's science.

"Just because you don't think it's science doesn't mean the rest of us don't."

What you or I think is not the question here. It's what those people were asked about what they thought, and they were not asked whether creationism was a scientific theory they subscribed to, nor were they asked if they thought it was science, nor were they asked whether creationism should be taught in science class.

They were asked what they believed and what they thought should be taught.

If you have a poll to back up your statement ("The public accepts Creationism as its scientific theory at a far higher rate."), then bring it on. The Pew poll ain't it, since it didn't ask those questions.

The only poll I could find that addressed the question of Creationism as a scientific theory was this one, the PFAW poll (2000):

In science, emphasize Evolution:

The overwhelming majority of Americans (83%) want Evolution taught in public schools. While many Americans also support the in-school discussion of religious explanations of human origins, the majority do not want these religious explanations presented as “science”. They would like these Creationist ideas to be taught about in separate classes other than science (such as Philosophy) or taught as a “belief”. Only a minority of the public (fewer than 3 in 10) wants Creationism taught as science in public schools.

A substantial majority of Americans (about 7 in 10) believe the scientific Theory of Evolution is compatible with a belief in God – one does not preclude the other.

Most of the public (66%) lean in the direction of placing the scientific stress on Evolution. This means that most support one of the following approaches:

-> Teach only Evolution (20% support).

-> Teach Evolution in science class with religious explanations taught in another class (such as Philosophy class) (17% support).

-> Teach Evolution as “scientific theory” in science class, but allow Creationism to be mentioned as a “belief” (29% support).

Other approaches are:

-> Both Evolution and Creationism should be taught as “scientific theories” in science class (13% support).

-> Teach only Creationism (with no mention of Evolution) (16% support).

Among all Americans, only 27% would classify Creationism as an accurate account of how humans developed.

(emphasis mine)

[M]ost Americans (64%) say they are open to the idea of teaching creationism along with evolution in the public schools, and a substantial minority (38%) favors replacing evolution with creationism in public school curricula.

... which doesn't tell us anything about whether they thought it should be taught in science or that they think it is a scientific theory.

Being "open to the idea of teaching creationism along with evolution in the public schools" would include, for example, categories such as "teaching Evolution in science class with religious explanations taught in another class (such as Philosophy class)" and "teaching Evolution as “scientific theory” in science class, but allowing Creationism to be mentioned as a “belief”", both of which found quite a few takers in the poll I cited.

Incidentally, the link you posted in the other thread was, surprise surprise, only based on the same misrepresentation and so did not constitute a link or quote that doesn't rest on the misrepresentation of "philosophy of biology" being "biology is classified as philosophy".

Like it or not, the theory of evolution is an accepted scientific theory that is currently not being challenged in any honest manner, and no alternative scientific theories have been presented.

Yes, Darwinism is the form of evolution accepted by a small minority. Creationism is the form, accepted by a strong plurality. In between is an ID minority. All think at least their own philosophy of evolution should be taught in school.

You really should try to comprehend what "philosophy of" means; your usage of it is all over the place...

More to the point: as the poll I cited above makes clear, Americans are on the whole quite pragmatic about this: by a large majority they would like to see the theory of evolution taught in science class (no small minority here at all), and also to see creationism presented, but in the appropriate venue, outside the science class and/or clearly labeled as a "belief".

Even though it seems incomprehensible to you, a large proportion also see no problem in combining acceptance of the theory of evolution with a belief in God. Being blind to this is why you insist on claiming that a "small minority" accepts the theory of evolution, when in actual fact it is a plurality.

[M]ost Americans (64%) say they are open to the idea of teaching creationism along with evolution in the public schools, and a substantial minority (38%) favors replacing evolution with creationism in public school curricula.