It's stories like these that make me raise the "b.s. flag" when liberals solemnly assure us of their devotion to free speech.

Explains why you need a Second Amendment.

The catch-22 fascist gambit. Define the laws so everyone is guilty of something, making it "legal" to remove anyone who is inconvenient.

I consider some of Vlaams Blok's positions and supporters to be indefensible. On my first visit to Belgium I was watching a VB rally on television. I couldn't understand what the speaker was saying but it's tone and manner was reminicent of those newsreels from Nazi Germany. Later while in Antwerp, which is the homebase of VB, there were posters from them which explicitly stated "Africans Out!".

Regardless though I find this stifling of free speech even more egregious.

MB, that would have been "Islamists out" or maybe "North-Africans out", that ethnic group being the vast majority of islamists in Belgium. Yes, the Vlaams Blok practices an ethnic nationalism (like all European nationalists), unlike American nationalism (nowadays a near monopoly of the Republican party or so it seems), which is based on an idea - a magnificent idea, I might add - formulated in the Declaration of Independence and the subsequent US Constitution.

Ethnic nationalism, which strives toward a state for every ethnically defined nation, is the best you're going to get in Europe. The alternatives are either a State (with a capital S) that compels different peoples into one synthetic nation, like France or the former Yugoslavia or Empire (like the Holy Roman Empire of Charlemagne or what the EU aspires to become). Judging from the wars these concepts have caused, I don't think they are preferable.

Yes, the consequence of ethnic nationalism is that it is much more difficult to join the nation if you're an outsider. But it's not impossible, as many well-integrated immigrants prove, in Flanders or elsewhere in Europa. Yes, the ethnic nationalism implies that Europe will never be fully at ease with mass immigration, but it isn't exactly a nearly empty land mass either (and even the near empty US of the 19th century wanted to control who entered the country).

VB rallies reminiscent of Nazi Germany ? On a much smaller scale, I suppose, and not nearly as well organized and orchestrated, which was exactly the point of the Nazi rallys : to impress people with their superior organization. VB rallies don't differ much from what other parties in those parts of Europe organize, except for the fact that there's still some enthusiasm at VB rallies. Before you pass judgments like that, bear in mind that conventions of both major parties in the US look like pseudo-fascist shows to many Europeans, with all those flags and anthems. Kerry even made his convention into some kind of military parade (or better, charade, because he didn't mean a word of it). And one further point : looking at a VB rally on the Flemish TV is like watching Dan Rather and expecting him to sing the praise of George W. Bush. If you think US media are left-wing, you aren't will acquainted with continental European media. I mean, these are people who suspect CNN of being right-wing.

On the basic issue of the fundamental freedoms, we seem to agree. It is chilling that a country like Belgium, which used to be the most liberal (in the traditional sense of the word) European country throughout the 19th century, with a constitution protecting the fundamental freedoms to the highest degree, is now a frontrunner in the struggle to outlaw those who voice concerns (the ugly way some of them choose to do so doesn't matter) about the islamofascist threat. It is unprecedented that a party garnering 25 % of the vote in a region like Flanders (which is for all practical purposes a nation of its own, as Belgium is basically split in two) is outlawed. It is mind-boggling that the Belgian Supreme Court can maintain with a straight face that these kind of laws don't restrict the freedom of speech.

And all of this came to pass exactly on the day that fifteen years ago the Berlin Wall fell. Fifteen years after a European totalitarianism died ungloriously, another one came to life.

Peter,

Good points for the most part. Yet the fact remains that the Vlaams Blok has a fairly large number of Hitler worshippers and Jew-haters.

For the moment, the Moroccans have replaced the Walloons and the Jews as Enemy # 1.

The VB have even offered some of their muscle to protect the Jewish community in Antwerp, simultaneously the city with Belgium's largest Jewish community and a large Muslim population. That offer, however, has been declined.

There is a strong suspicion that the VB, if they ever succeed in seceding from Wallonia and removing the Múslims, will kick out the Jews next, never mind the 2000 years' Jewish presence in Europe. (In this they would be perfectly justified, according to Orrin.)

So, from a Jewish perspective I'd be very wary of the VB. Far more preferable to get the established parties to adopt a harder line towards Muslim immigration and lawlessness.

Eugene S.

There are virtually no Jews left in Flanders except for some Hasidim, mostly connected with the diamond industry. My understanding is that to the extent they participate in the political process, many if not most actually voted for the Blok.

The VB, for better or worse, are the only people interested in keeping the streets clear of the criminal Muslim hordes. The VB is content to allow and even encourage Jews to leave the public school system and educate their children in cheders, which is fine with the Hasidim.

Sure the VB says terrible things about Jews in general and Israel in particular, but then all Belgian political parties are anti-Israel. If you want to read chilling rhetoric, read some of the statements by Louis Michel, the Belgian Foreign Minister and a member of the Liberal Party.

The above comments should be understood to be Flanders-specific, as there are significant secular and modern Orthodox Jewish populations in Bruxelles and Liege.

Mornin' Bart!

You're up early.

The VB, for better or worse, are the only people interested in keeping the streets clear of the criminal Muslim hordes

I'm hoping this will change.

Agree about M. Michel.

Bart,

While it is true that the first vice-president of the VB had the disgusting habit of denying the holocaust (the man got kicked out of his vice presidency and his senate seat for that reason), the party as such has never in any way or form exhibited anti-Semitic remarks or programs. On the contrary, it is the only party in Belgium that supports Israel's right of self-defense against the Palestinian terrorists. The way things are going now, it may well be the only party to recognize Israel's right of existence. I strongly doubt that if Israel were to be founded today, the Belgian government would be willing to recognize it.

Eugene S.,

There is absolutely no indication that the VB would kick out the Jews. Whether the VB voters love or hate the Jewish community in Antwerp is beside the point. They leave them alone, like most parties in Antwerp do and the majority of Antwerp Jews being Hassidim, they're perfectly happy to be left alone. When the Arab Sturmabteilung (er, Arab European League) of the infamous Abu Jahjah threatened to harm the Jews, the VB was the party that most ardently defended them (the Jews, not the thugs of Abu Jahjah).

Your point about forcing the mainstream parties to adopt a tougher stance against islamism is theoretically true. The problem is that they show no inclination to do so however. They have had every opportunity over the past 15 years (the VB scored its first big victory in 1991), but they never did so. Part of the reason is the de facto dominance of the Wallonian socialist party, which heavily relies on the immigrant vote in Brussels (to clarify things : Brussels is historically a stronghold of the francophone liberal party and its slightly more progressive but linguistically radical partners of the FDF). The francophone socialists have now taken over power in Brussels by enrolling large numbers of voters of Moroccon origin. Their party lists in the recent elections were filled with those people, some of which are rumored to be pure islamofascists. Many of these people routinely express their adoration for the likes of Usama bin Ladin and Al-Zarqawi. The francophone socialists are also the main protectors of the so-called Muslim Executive, a government body organizing the relations with the Muslim community. Almost all of the ME members have been labeled as dangerous islamists by the Belgian secret service. Yet the francophone socialist minister of Justice refuses to take action against them.

It is this party that doesn't allow any other partner in the four-party coalition government to take a tougher position on islamism. Otherwise, they disband the coalition, which would lead to new elections (no mainstream party in Flanders wants those, because they know the VB or its successor would score a major victory). The christian democrats, who are in the opposition on the federal level, but are the senior partner in the regional Flemish government are equally frightened by the prospect of new elections. It's a enormous prisoner dilemma basically.

It is incredibly short sighted for Belgium to do this. First, a party is only people. The party will disband and a new party will arise. It will do better than ever. Second, in a democracy, if you deny democratic rights to a group of people, then they will turn to violence in fact rather than in theory.

This banning of parties is one of the things the Weimer Republic did. That worked out well.

When people cannot have their grievances addressed by political process, they begin to turn to the only people who promise to address them. Rather than outlawing the VB, the govt should have started addressing the grievances of the people.

Peter:

"...that would have been "Islamists out" or maybe "North-Africans out"...

This was in 1995. I was visiting one of my best friends who is Flemish. I can only tell you that according to him this was a specific reference to Black Africans who had emigrated to Belgium primarily from their former colony the Belgian Congo. That's not to say that they were real fond of the Moroccans and other Arabs either though (or the Walloons for that matter!).

"VB rallies reminiscent of Nazi Germany ?"

I was more or less simply relating my own impression of the mannerisms, tone, and cadence of the speaker. The rally or convention, whatever it was, consisted of perhaps a few dozen people.

"If you think US media are left-wing, you aren't will acquainted with continental European media."

No worries here. I'm well aware that Euromedia is is about as leftwing as it gets. They make the NY Times and the Nation seem like rightwing pub's by comparison.

Bob,

As a matter of fact, the Weimar Republic was extremely liberal. It allowed the Nazis (not banned) and the Communists (not banned) almost free rein to destroy it.

By the time we've brought democracy to the Middle East, they'll be begging for it in Europe.

Let them beg. By then, it will be The Will of Allah.

Ken, beware of the fact that France is a nuclear power. I wouldn't mind if the unwashed, cheese-eating surrender monkeys had to live like dhimmis in their own country, but the idea of an Al-Zarqawi lookalike holding his finger on the French launch button doesn't appeal to me.

Peter,

If the French nukes work as well as their aircraft carrier, we have nothing to worry about.

Bart, maybe you're right. The French nukes are probably mounted on cheese-fueled surrender missiles.

I thought the Rexists were still the biggest party.