PINKY, THE BRAIN:

Benazir Bhutto's answer to al-Qaeda: Al-Qaeda has united disparate militant groups into an international confederate of terrorists who exploit local tensions, with the aim of creating theocratic dictatorships, former Pakistani premier Benazir Bhutto tells Syed Saleem Shahzad . But they can be thwarted. (Asia Times, 11/.03/04)

Asia Times Online: Islamic extremists have called for "death to America", with no room for compromise. Why has this extremism emerged now, and not, for instance, during the Cold War?

Benazir Bhutto: The slogan "death to America" was, to my knowledge, raised before Islamic extremists took center stage in global politics. If I recall correctly, it was used way back in Latin America during the times of Che Guevara and Pancho Villa. The slogan is today considered more deadly because of the events of 9/11. In the past, it was more a manifestation of anger or resentment among those who raised such slogans. The events of 9/11 have given it a less rhetorical content.

During the Cold War the countries which felt aggrieved used superpower rivalry to promote their agendas. With the demise of the Soviet Union, and the rise of Islamic extremists during the fight against the Soviet occupation [of Afghanistan], Islamic extremists felt that they could take on the remaining superpower. It is unlikely that non-state actors can take on a superpower without being assisted by another superpower. However, they can cause random terror, spread insecurity and fear, give birth to a clash of cultures and religions and create more hatred and intolerance. This is the real danger. We need to counter such extremism by promoting unity, tolerance and respect to different races, religions and genders. In such moderation lies the harmony and well being of the world community. Moreover, we need to address unresolved political issues to prevent extremists from exploiting them for their own narrow and theocratic ends.

ATol: The US says "you are with us or against us" - all-out war with no compromise.

Bhutto: The impact of 9/11 was dramatic and led to a dramatic declaration that either you are with us or against us. The United States was struck in its financial and political center - while Pearl Harbor was on the periphery in comparison. Pearl Harbor drew the US into World War II. The attacks of 9/11 have drawn it into the war against terror. For some time, the events of 9/11 will continue to dominate the agenda of global politics, with the US in the lead. [...]

ATol: Previously, Islamic fundamentalist parties could not make headway in elections, now they are emerging as a challenge in countries such as Pakistan, Afghanistan, Turkey, Malaysia and Indonesia.

Bhutto: Extremist and fundamentalist political parties have never been able to score any significant political victories in countries like Pakistan. In fact, if the past record is any guide, it is clear that the extremist parties were never voted into power or even brought close to it by the people. The extremists rose under the dictatorship of General Zia ul-Haq in Pakistan. The religious parties [Muttahhida Majlis-e-Amal] formed a government for the first time [in North West Frontier Province] under General Musharraf's dictatorship. [...]

ATol: There is an extreme feeling of dissent within religious political parties, which is further giving birth to more extreme notions. Jihadi organizations are one manifestation, but there is a very strong opinion flourishing in the shape of Hizbut Tehrir-like organizations, which has taken strong roots in Central Asia and is silently taking root in Pakistan. Unlike religious-political parties, they do not believe in democracy at all. What is the perspective of these trends?

Bhutto: During the days of fighting the Soviet occupation in Afghanistan [1980s], a military dictator in Pakistan [Zia] used religious parties to recruit fighters. He used money to set up religious schools whose real purpose was to indoctrinate young men into becoming robots. Since he was associated with the Muslim Brotherhood, he used those links to bring together members of the Muslim Brotherhood from different parts of the world. They were brainwashed into believing that after defeating the Soviet Union, they could take on the other superpower, namely America. They were never told that the success against the Soviets was because it was a proxy war with international backing.

That is the bitter irony, that the mujahadeen won--even against so feeble an enemy as the Soviets-- only because of us, but because so much of our assistance was kept secret they imagined they could take us too. They misunderstood their own David and Goliath story, that once we gave them their sling (Stingers and the like), they could hardly lose to the lumbering and backwards Goliath, but they could never figure out the sling on their own.

Posted by Orrin Judd at November 2, 2004 8:57 AM