May 28, 2004
KNOWING YOUR ALLIES:
Muslims for the Coalition (Stephen Schwartz, 5/28/04, Weekly Standard)
American Shia Muslims claim two million adherents in the United States and Canada, mainly drawn from India, Pakistan, Iran, and Iraq, with a sprinkling from Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, East Africa, and the Balkans. Iraqi Shias are concentrated in Dearborn, Michigan, and Los Angeles and are expected to be well-represented at the gathering this weekend.The first such convention, held in the nation's capital last year with 3,000 delegates, featured a surprising banquet speaker: deputy Defense secretary Paul Wolfowitz. While this year's banquet program had not been fixed by Thursday afternoon, UMAA media representative Agha Shawkat Jafri said the delegates have received hundreds of calls from Iraqi Shias expressing hope that the convention can draw the attention of the Pentagon to their concerns, which are centered on the need for forcible action against rebel Shia leader Moktada al-Sadr.
"Our people view Moktada al-Sadr as a dangerous renegade and adventurer, who threatens the safety of every Shia Muslim in Iraq," Jafri said. "We do not want the Coalition forces to inflict harm on the holy sites in Najaf or Karbala, but we want al-Sadr firmly defeated. The best action would be to support the Iraqi Shias in combating him. Give them the power and they will get rid of the problem."
Jafri said that Shias were disturbed and hurt by the scandal of prison abuses at Abu Ghraib but understand the difference between the Coalition forces and the former regime. "In the Coalition forces, these cruel acts represented the prejudice and indiscipline of a tiny, exceptional minority, and they will be punished. In Saddam's army, it was required of them and they were rewarded for it."
Jafri said Iraqi Shias are "terrified that if the U.S. in Iraq leaves, the Wahhabis concentrated in Falluja and Tikrit will begin a wholesale genocide of Shias, repeating the earlier actions of the Saddam regime."
Our past actions more than justify their fears that we'll betray them again. Posted by Orrin Judd at May 28, 2004 2:49 PM
"Our past actions more than justify their fears that we'll betray them again."
oj you are one confusing dude. Do you want to get out or do you want to stay until the job's done?
Posted by: NC3 at May 28, 2004 3:00 PMLet them run the country with us providing their security until they don't want us. It's the least we owe them.
Posted by: oj at May 28, 2004 3:09 PMOJ
What past actions are you referring to? Our encouragement to overthrow Saddam?
Then bailing out when they rose up and helping him in his war against Iran.
Posted by: oj at May 28, 2004 3:52 PMNoam I mean OJ
Aid in the Iran War was minimal, but justified. It's not like Iran was an innocent bystander that we suddenly decided to overthrow. You yourself have said that the Iranian populace is supportive of the US.
We bombed the h*ll out of Saddam in 1991, I don't see any betrayal in not sacrificing American lives to liberate Iraqi Shites who even now seem prone to shoot us in the back.
Posted by: h-man at May 28, 2004 4:11 PMh:
All we had to do was not let his helicopters fly in '91 and they'd likely have succeeded in liberating themselves. But once we went to war with the nation we owed it to the Iraqi people to liberate them, not impose sanctions on them.
As for helping him in the Iran War--fine we were justified in helping him kill Shi'ites. Now they're justified in getting back at us, right?
Posted by: oj at May 28, 2004 4:18 PMActually, the betrayal came even _before_ the affair of the helicopters, when Bush the elder chose to end the war at 100 hours for the sake of the newspapers instead of taking one more day to finish off the Republican Guard for good when V and VII Corps had it boxed up against Basra and there was literally only one route left open for them to escape over.
Posted by: Joe at May 28, 2004 8:09 PMOJ
They don't seem to have trouble shooting down our helicopters.
You answered NC3 that it was the least we owed them. I guess I figure they owe us.
"Jafri said Iraqi Shias are "terrified that if the U.S. in Iraq leaves, the Wahhabis concentrated in Falluja and Tikrit will begin a wholesale genocide of Shias, repeating the earlier actions of the Saddam regime."
The above statement doesn't indicate a people who are going to "drive" the Sunni into Syria. But if we aid the Shiite, then are not we betraying the Sunni and they would be justified in killing us.
Joe
Actually the "sell out" was made before the war started because of promises Bush the Elder made to Saudis and other members of the coalition.
Posted by: h-man at May 28, 2004 8:35 PMOJ
Is that a royal "we".
Shiite should quickly adopt the Kurdish stance regarding their "foreign policy" or their self-govt will be short lived. My assumption is that they will be tested in the future and our "greatness" might not be a "great" as you think.
A democratic we.
Posted by: oj at May 29, 2004 7:14 AM