June 30, 2005
THAT GAIA'S ONE TOUGH BROAD (via Jim Yates):
Warmer air may cause more sea ice cover (June 30, 2005)
A new study says predicted increases in precipitation due to warmer air temperatures may actually increase sea ice volume in the Antarctic's Southern Ocean.
The findings on greenhouse effects point to asymmetry between the two poles and may be an indication that climate change processes may have varying impacts on different areas of the globe."Most people have heard of climate change and how rising air temperatures are melting glaciers and sea ice in the Arctic," said Dylan C. Powell, lead author of the study and a doctoral student at the University of Maryland.
"However, findings from our simulations suggest a counterintuitive phenomenon. Some of the melt in the Arctic may be balanced by increases in sea ice volume in the Antarctic."
What could be more quintessentially human than our routine overestimations of our impact on the planet? Posted by Orrin Judd at June 30, 2005 9:40 PM
This is one more illustration that you can make models that show any result.
Posted by: pj at June 30, 2005 10:24 PM-- indication that climate change processes may have varying impacts on different areas of the globe. ---
And how much did that enlightened statement cost?
To me, that more of a "well, duh!"
Posted by: Sandy P at June 30, 2005 11:20 PMBased on all the studies that have come out, global warming apparently is the cause of warming, cooling, drought, floods, glaciers melting, ice packs forming, dandruff, gingivitis, mold, poor satellite reception, bovine flatulence, Geraldo Rivera and the designated hitter rule. Truly a horrible deforming of nature by human beings (specifically in the central lattitudes of the North American continent, which is the nexus of evil and selfishness in the world).
Posted by: John at July 1, 2005 12:14 AMThis is one more illustration that you can make models that show any result.
Particularly since, in this case, not all of the variables are known, and of those that ARE known, few firm figures are available.
One simply plugs in whatever values best fit one's notion about what the outcome should be.
For instance, it's not at all impossible that we're at the beginning of a new ice age, despite the (possibly) rising temps.
Posted by: Michael Herdegen at July 1, 2005 12:16 AMAnd what a lot of people fail to take into account is that this planet has feedback mechanisms built into its systems that have worked for millions of years, and that we haven't found all of them because some only appear in extreme circumstances (like in reaction to an ice age). When your model shows a linear trend, or one that goes way off scale, or some other nonsense, the first question you should be asking is what got left out. or what you did wrong. But thanks to politicized science, those questions are shouted down.
Most of these models, if run given conditions in 1850 or 1900, would show conditions nothing like the real 2000. If you can't predict the past and the present, then you shouldn't be predicting the future, either.
Posted by: Raoul Ortega at July 1, 2005 1:00 AMMichael - It's worse than that, there's no theoretical mechanism to constrain the number of parameters or the relationships between them. Even the "greenhouse effect" is not based on any radiative transfer calculations, because greenhouse physics would give an effect two orders of magnitude too small.
Posted by: pj at July 1, 2005 8:17 AMPJ:
Something else I have always wondered about the greenhouse gas effect, but haven't seen mentioned anywhere.
Since greenhouse gases block Earth's Infrared (IR) wavelength radiation emissions into space, presumably CO2 et al do the same thing in reverse--increasingly prevening the sun's radiation in the IR band from getting to the Earth in the first place.
Jeff: You're right, CO2 blocks infrared going both ways. But since most of the sun's output is in the visible, while most of the earth's output is in the infrared, this is much more significant for the earth's radiation.
Now, clouds are great at not just blocking, but reflecting visible light. Which is why clouds are about 100 times more important than CO2 (a 1% increase in cloud cover cancels out a 100% increase in CO2). If I had to identify just where the sleight-of-hand is taking place in this scam, it would be in how the models handle cloud cover.
"What could be more quintessentially human than our routine overestimations of our impact on the planet?"
Indeed. It calls to mind an obscene joke (warning for the faint-hearted, read no further):
What's the definition of arrogance?
An ant humping an elephant, yelling, "Take it all, beeyatch!"
Earth is the elephant; enviromentalists are the ant.
Posted by: Tom at July 2, 2005 9:09 AMThe cleaner version being: "Sorry, did I hurt you?" Used it yesterday for Chirac.
Posted by: oj at July 2, 2005 10:09 AMBob:
Thanks.
I'm sure your answer is completely correct, but just out of curiousity, I should track down somewhere the power spectrum of the Sun's emissions v. the Earth's.
Posted by: Jeff Guinn at July 2, 2005 3:04 PM